Meeting spins
out of control,
with no votes
- Analysis
Andrews – Robert’s rules definitely were not in order.
The new Andrews ABC Board held a meeting Thursday that essentially amounted to no action at all because members never actually voted on anything, despite having the necessary motions required to take action on several issues.
While the new board could argue that their lack of experience is to blame for failing to follow standard governmental practices and procedures, it doesn’t explain why three experienced people who participated in the meeting never addressed the lack of a vote. Moreover, some of the participants in last week’s meeting showed little interest in learning the state laws that regulate board protocols and operation of the ABC store.
The new board was established more than two months ago, yet some of the members in attendance had not even read the state statutes related to ABC stores. The board even canceled its July meeting due to “scheduling conflicts,” yet board members were paid for the month as if they had met.
The new board members could have used that time to familiarize themselves with Robert’s Rules of Order and the state laws regulating ABC boards and liquor stores.
“It ain’t my responsibility to get on Google,” Pedro Wilson said when fellow board member Debbie Ambler told him the statutes could be found on the state’s website. “The internet is not an acceptable source of information. I want it from the State of North Carolina. I want them to send me and the rest of us board members a copy, and if they do not then [it’s not acceptable].”
‘Micromanagement’
State law says the ABC Commission “shall distribute at no charge one copy of Chapter 18B of the General Statutes and the Commission’s Rules to each local ABC board.” Law further states that additional copies may be purchased from the commission or accessed online without charge.
The new board had a copy of the statutes at the meeting last week. However, Wilson, who presided over the meeting in the absence of board Chairman Tony Painter, did not seem interested in reading them.
In fact, every time Ambler pointed out that a state statute was not being followed, several people in attendance showed disinterest and outright contempt for her concerns.
Ambler is the secretary for Cherokee County Sheriff Derrick Palmer. It stands to reason that she would be adamant about the board and ABC store following state statutes, especially considering that not doing so could affect her employment with the sheriff’s office. However, some members of the board and local citizens interpreted her concerns as “micromanagement.”
“I’m not much into micromanaging, never have been,” Wilson said. “If I have a manager and she’s running the department like it needs to be run and it is successful, then I say leave it as it is. If she is not and it is faltering, then we need to change and fix the problem. Micromanaging should be out of the question.”
Robert’s Rules of Order
Local ABC boards are considered “public bodies” under North Carolina law and must follow state statutes, which among other things require boards to follow rules that are “generally accepted principles of parliamentary procedure.”
Robert’s Rules of Order is a manual of parliamentary procedure that governs most organizations with boards of directors throughout the state and across the United States. For an action to become official under Robert’s Rules of Order, several steps must be taken:
- A member must raise a motion.
- Another member must second the motion.
- The members must debate the motion.
- The chairperson must restate the motion and then ask for affirmative votes, followed by negative votes.
- The chairperson must announce the result of the vote.
While each issue raised at the meeting received the necessary motions to proceed to a vote, a consensus never took place. Since members never voted on a consensus, no official action was taken pursuant to ABC Commission rules and regulations.
According to the operations manual governing North Carolina alcoholic beverage control boards, members are recommended to obtain a copy of Robert’s Rules of Order “for specific procedural questions. The rules consist of how members must take votes, speak during the board meeting, introduce a topic or rescind a vote.”
The manual further states that “board meetings should be conducted in a formal manner,” and “members of the board cannot speak out of turn.”
Interruptions
At the highly disruptive meeting last week, several members interrupted Ambler whenever she pointed out laws that were not being followed. A member of the community also yelled at Ambler, and even moved to a seat at the board’s table without permission to do so.
State law prohibits the interruption of such meetings, saying that any person who “disrupts an official meeting” and then “willfully refuses to leave” after being directed to do so is “guilty of a Class 2 misdemeanor.”
State law also requires boards to maintain a record of minutes for each meeting, which should include the result of each vote and document all negative votes. The Cherokee Scout obtained copies of ABC board meeting minutes dating back to the beginning of this year, some of which only state that a “motion was approved,” without documenting whether the vote was unanimous or consisted of a dissenting voice.
The Scout contacted the state ABC Commission to understand the seriousness of not following state statutes. A spokesperson replied, “Boards are required to follow state law related to public meetings of public bodies. The board is required to follow the law, and each member of the board receives a hard copy of the current ABC laws. Records of the board’s actions, including minutes, are public record.”
State statutes
At the meeting, Ambler raised several issues she believes are covered under state statutes, such as an employee being hired without board permission and without undergoing a background check, the board being paid about $100 for July without holding a single meeting, store hours being changed without board approval and unapproved meeting minutes being distributed to the press before the board had a chance to vote on its accuracy.
In response to some of Ambler’s concerns, store manager Donna Cutshaw, who also serves as the board’s clerk, said she “didn’t know” anything about the statutes. To that, Ambler replied, “She’s been manager for how many years?”
Cutshaw has been store manager since 2012.
It was abundantly clear that new board members would benefit from having an attorney advise them on state statutes. However, when Ambler brought up a recommendation from town attorney Darryl Brown, who previously told them the ABC board approves new hires and should mandate a background check, Jack Frahmann interrupted her and said, “Darryl Brown has no authority over this board.”
Frahmann has been the store’s finance officer since 2013 but does not serve as an appointed board member.
While none of the town’s aldermen attended the ABC board meeting, the perceived lack of interest in state statutes and the unorganized, disrespectful nature of the meeting is a reflection on them. The aldermen are supposed to interview and vet ABC board members to ensure they are serious about spending time to understand the role before appointing them to the position.
Aldermen disbanded the previous three-person ABC board in favor of a five-person board in May amid concerns regarding “illegal” board meetings and alleged “illegal activity” at the liquor store.
“You have to do your due diligence to see how a formal meeting is carried out in order to sit on any board,” said Mayor James Reid, who has served as an elected official since 2001. “It is my wish that all of the ABC board members spend time to see how a meeting is supposed to be conducted.
“I spent a lot of time during my first four years in office making sure each meeting was conducted legally. You can’t just show up on the night of a meeting and make a decision; you have to do your own homework.”